Chris:
We're finally doing it. I'm finally doing it. Man, we've been talking about this podcast for months. It's, yeah.
Steve:
It's happening. Half-star were together, we're like, this should be a podcast right now. And now is now.
Chris:
Now is now. I'm glad we're on it, finally. Me too. You know what's funny about a podcast, especially when we're co-hosting a podcast? Yeah, yeah, that's good. Is when you listen to the podcast without watching the video version, is you always want their whose person is who, you know, trying to, yeah, to get around the voices, you know, the tone's okay.
Steve:
Yeah, do you ever get those podcasts where they sound very similar? I know. It's or TV announcers even. Yes, you're like, which guy is this? I'm telling you. Sports announcer sometimes. All the guys out there, they're all like, ah, the guy who wrapped cars fastened them. Like those guys, and I'm like, who want which guys?
Chris:
But I'll tell it right now, it's not going to happen on this podcast. No, no. Especially with my Alabama accent.
Steve:
Deep South. Yeah, deep, deep South.
Chris:
I don't know if you guys noticed, but I am French Canadian. So there you go. You, yep.
Steve:
So not the worst thing you've been called. I've been called worse, man. So you all know food. That's one thing I learned about your French Canadians. You guys know food. We love food. Yeah, culture. Oh, man. That's one thing I noticed. Every time I made a true French Canadian, I'm like, you know food and wine and man.
Chris:
I have to say we do. Yeah. I will admit.
Steve: I'm not ashamed.
Chris: We are good at this. If there's one thing, that's the one. That's the one. That's the one.
Steve: What are we talking about today?
Chris: Hey, that's the thing. We don't even know. I'm not sure. You know, so this is basically what you guys are going to get. You know, watching this podcast or listening to this podcast. It's me, Steve, talking about stuff. You know, especially home studio stuff. You know, that's going to be our. So if you're here to, and you are hoping to watch a cooking channel podcast of some sort, it's not going to happen. Even if I like food a lot, it's not going to happen. You're pretty good cook though. That's what they say. Yeah. Yeah. You know, you say that. I do say that. And my guests also tend to agree with my face.
Steve: And then you tell me they said it. Yeah. Those data is coming from you. That's my poster syndrome coming out.
Chris: I need to justify myself with the kind of others.
Steve: That's nothing wrong with that.
Chris: What could go wrong? Hey, man. Hey, you're taking care of cattle.
Steve: So that's right. Who to thunk it?
Chris: You know, as studio guy, music producer, working on the farm with cows with cows.
Steve: I raise them. You eat them.
Chris: No, people are going to, you know, whether you're going to stick around. Yeah. Or just going to switch to another video right now.
Steve: If I wasn't me, I'm not sure what I would do.
Chris: But we're looking forward for this podcast. So how things are going to, you know, the stuff we talked about before shooting, starting to press on record on this video is we want to talk about home studio stuff, questions, answer questions. Actually, this is going to be a good part of the podcast. Eventually, what we want to do is to answer anyone's questions that you leave in the comments section. If you're watching the YouTube version or you can send us an email, I'm going to leave the link to the email, which I'm not sure which one to use yet because this is still the first episode. So there's a lot of stuff to figure out that learning worked on.
Steve: Yes. Learning how to fly while in the air.
Chris: Exactly. So it's going to be listed in the show notes. Anyways, you can ask us any questions related to home studio, mixing, recording, mastering, whatever you want. Cooking. Cooking with plugins. Ah, what about that?
Steve: See what you did there. Oh, yeah. So anything goes, any questions, we will take the time to answer and just going to make
Chris: this podcast pretty interesting. It's going to be a conversation between me and Steve, of course, but also a conversation answering your question. And if you want to jump on the podcast with us, asking your question live with us, you can do so. Just write it into your email and of course won't be able to take everyone. But I'm going to ask you a question. Take everyone, but maybe you'll be the lucky one.
Steve: And I think a big part of what we're doing here, just the way I think we naturally posture ourselves in life is that we aren't big knowledge based theoretical audio people. Exactly. For us, it's way more. How does it feel? That's the whole sounds good to us idea, right? Yes. Is that it's, if it sounds good, it is good, right? And so just how do we get to that point? There's a lot of great theoretical detail available that some of it we know, some of it we don't. But I think at the end of the day for us is just how do we chat? How do we have an ongoing conversation? Yes. That I think from an audience perspective, I think it's very important. There's going to be a lot of like, I don't know, what do you guys think built into this that I think is going to make this kind of a fun community effort more than just us talking about how to do something or totally, totally agree.
Chris: And the reality is we don't have all the answers.
Steve: Only a couple. Only a few. And some have to do with audio. Some. The rest about cooking. You.
Chris: Now on my YouTube channel, if you're watching or listening to this podcast, you, the first one, you probably are part of my mix on a line mailing list. And lately, I've published a video talking about mixing on headphones that went pretty well on YouTube. And Steve was actually asking me to maybe elaborate a bit more or go over a few things I went to through on this video. So what's your take about that mixing on headphones?
Steve: It's just such an, it's an interesting topic. It is. It's compelling because, you know, what, what comes with the room, what comes with speakers is the room. And what comes with a proper mix room is a lot of stuff. Yes. So math, science, wizardry. And what comes with headphones is headphones. And so to me, there's, you know, is it a shortcut? Is it a hack? Is it a final answer? I don't know. Some would say yes. Some would say, heck no. So I think somewhere in the middle lies the answer. Right. And so, but as a tool, I think it's, you know, it's, it's, you know, I've come to realize if you're not mixing in and utilizing headphones at some point in there, you know, you're, you're trying to build without using a hammer or something, right? So it is, it is a very, very necessary tool. And so I think, yeah, for me, learning more about it, because, you know, we started chatting just one day offline. Yeah. Even before I think you did that, that, that, that video and I was just like peppering you with questions, you know, I hate the way these headphones sound. And you're like, well, there's a solution for that. You dumb, dumb. And you know, you can change the sound of the headphones. And I was like, ha ha ha. What about that? So then I started learning all about this. And I went down a little rabbit hole of, you know, Harman curves and stuff. I'm sure you're going to talk about more. And so yeah, to me, the answer, the short answer is, it's very compelling. And I think it's very now and it's important and we're mixing on planes and in hotel rooms and, and in our, you know, our, our, our cousins basements at Christmas dinner, you know, or whatever. And so I think, yeah, something we need to know about as audio engineers.
Chris: I think so. I think so too. You know what, but pushed me to mix on headphones more and more was just before my move to Calgary. Because by the way, we, we live in the same city. You know, that's the reason why we're able to do what we are doing right now, being on sites, doing this podcast. So we're in Calgary, Alberta, Canada. I used to live in Quebec. And I, when I was planning on moving, this is when I was okay, I'm going to move in a new space. I'm probably going to rent a house before buying a house, which we did. So man, I need to, to, you know, keep going at my work, mixing gigs and stuff, you know. So I think at that time was like, okay, mixing on headphones is going to be a very, very good tool. I need to train myself to mix on headphones. And I start to, to use my headphones for mixing and mastering maybe like at least a year before moving here. And the more I dove into this topic of mixing on headphones, this is at some point I discover the Harman curve. And this actually when I moved here, I was already in place. And but before the Harman curve, it was a chat that I had with Andrew Sheps at NAMM. He's the one who actually encouraged, like not personally encouraged me, but I was pretty encouraged to continue and like diving more into mixing on headphones just because he did on his own on his side. And by only using even the cheap pair of headphones, and that was pretty fascinating for me. And we're talking about the Sony's MDR 7506, which sucks so bad. I hate those headphones. Even if it was the first pair of headphones I purchased when I started audio school. And at the time, you know, it sounded pretty good to me, you know, but you know, the more I, the more experience I gained, I just ended up hitting these headphones. So aggressive on the mid range, especially the high mids. And anyways, I don't want to get into debunking what the these headphones sounds like. But point is that Sheps used them for years to maybe I would say spend 90% of his time mixing on these headphones just because he knows them pretty well. That kid did all right. Apparently he did. Sheps feller. Apparently going places.
Steve: I, you know, dream of. Not to the least.
Chris: So now if it, you know, of course he has lots of experience, but point is he was able to do it. So I was like, you know, why not? Why not train myself to go to, to this point with, you know, a pair of headphones I like to work with.
Steve: And, and there's a whole thing there too, right? Like that word train yourself. There's something to that. Yes. Like any change in your environment, you have to do the time. And that's, that's the part that I was missing is I would mix and mix and mix and I put a headphones ago. I don't like this. This makes me feel not great. And so I go back to the sound banging around the room and cross talking and doing all its things that sound does. But the, the training piece and that was after our talk, I started to spending more time. And once you got to settle in, then it was opposite. Then I'd take them off and I'd be like, hi, I feel sad out here. So yeah, there is something to the training.
Chris: The training is the, yeah, the part that a lot of people miss. Because it's such a radical change. It is. It is. And it's, it doesn't matter if it's an expensive pair of headphones. It doesn't matter. You know, people think that, okay, I'm going to buy this pair of odd disease, which are great, like the MM 500, for example, that I like a lot, which apparently sheps recently switched on. So he kind of ditched the 7506. Good for him.
Steve: I hope his mix is still good. Oh, I'm pretty sure he's going to get around.
Chris: It'll be all right. And even with that, you know, even with these types of headphones, good quality, high quality headphones, you still need to take the time. Yes. To train yourself mixing on headphones.
Steve: And even in that, you let me a couple of big dog pairs. Yes. And I spent time with the first pair and then switch to the second pair. And I didn't like the second pair. I know you told me. And it was just because maybe I spent too much time with the first pair. Maybe. Right. If the order was backwards, what I felt differently. So I might steal those again before we get there. That's good because they do sound good. It's a good difference. What's that in your pocket, Steve? Nothing. Those are not out of seats. Nice try. I can see the cord.
Chris: At least hide the cord. Yeah. No, I know, praying yourself is very important because there's challenges when you start mixing on headphones, you know, there's stuff that you won't get or, you know, out of the box, you're not going to get compared to mix column on boxes on speakers.
Steve: And some of this to me might be, you know, like I bought a little Bluetooth broadcaster box because I spent so much time with my AirPods in that I says to myself, I want to check my mixes on these AirPods. And so I got my little $30 Bluetooth broadcaster off Amazon and it spits out whatever's coming out of my controller to the things and it pairs. And it's great. I can just put them in at pairs and away I go. And instantly I started making changes to my mix because I knew these little things so much because I've listened to so many records on these things just over years, right? And so there is something to the comfort factor of that that regardless of how much they cost or don't cost and are they oddest user of the AirPods, I just know what they sound like. Exactly. Right. And so and albums I'd listened to on AirPods, I'd listened to all my monitors while I was setting up a session or whatever. So I knew even how things translated from the room to those. Because translation is important. So there's something there about the comfort that you're right about. And so a guy like Sheps on Sony's, he just knows him. And he knows how that's going to sound in somebody's car two years from now as he's doing it, right? So do they have to be expensive?
Chris: You know, there's always trade off. There's a trade off on everything. If you get a cheaper pair of headphones, in my experience, cheaper pair of headphones are less detailed. You know, it's not that the, you know, can things be too detailed?
Steve: Maybe. Like I've been on those autoses and I was just like, oh, like I'm tweaking stuff that I didn't even know was in the mix.
Chris: Exactly. And this is the stuff you won't get with the cheaper pair of headphones. Correct.
Steve: Or a mediocre room and some affordable speaker. Same thing. Same thing. So you're right. So that's where the tool piece comes in, right? Yes. It's not an and it's it's a both, right?
Chris: Yeah, exactly. Dang it. So there's stuff. Stuff you can do.
Steve: It's got cost me money.
Chris: There's stuff you can do to get the experience on mixing on headphones way better, like the Harman curve, you know, EQing your headphones.
Steve: Explain the Harman curve. Let's let's let's do this professor. Oh, no, I'm not a geeky guy, you know, give me give me the my nature. Give me the Chris notes on this.
Chris: But basically the Harman curve to sum this up very, very quickly. It's basically a NICU curve that is going to emulate the sound of high quality speakers in a acoustically well treated room.
Steve: And if flats treated room, basically, is it done via meters or done via taste? Oh, yes.
Chris: I think it's a blend of both. If I'm not mistaken, because it changes. Yeah. Every second year or so, the tweak that up a bit, you know, there's different versions of the Harman curve. And even when I apply the Harman curve, I base myself on that and then I tweak that to my taste because there's always the human taste that is a factor. Yeah. And it's impossible to kind of apply like this is the correct 100% curve you need to use that will fit all humans. So we'll have different tastes. We all hear music differently, slightly, at least.
Steve: So the idea is there is this EQ curve. Yes. That is supposedly flat and beautiful and amazing. You then or they or somebody then checks the headphones against that curve. And then you then apply an EQ to try to make it match that curve on output.
Chris: Yeah. Is that basically? That's basically my. That's basically. But again, it's not like a curve that is going to bring your headphones flat. It emulates a flat like good high quality speakers in the flat well treated room.
Steve: So every pair of headphones will take sound and treat it differently. And this curve when applied theoretically brings them closer to this.
Chris: What generally humans will tend to like this.
Steve: So you're applying a different curve EQ setup to every pair of headphones. Yeah.
Chris: And some headphones are really close by nature.
Steve: I was going to say based and that's where higher quality might win. Yes. In some ways because it can pull things out that a lesser pair of headphones could not. If it ain't there, it just ain't there. You can dig for it as an EQ, right? But if you've got a big beautiful pair of headphones, you can get those little minute. Yeah, exactly.
Chris: Okay. So that's about it as far as the, you know, the harm and curve goes. And in my experience, since I start to work with the arm and curve, it gives me a way better experience listening to music in my headphones, but also better mixing decisions and translation with quicker to get a good translation across the board.
Steve: It is radically different. It is. When you apply, like you gave me the headphones to borrow and you sent me to what is auto EQ? Yes. I think auto EQ. And I did that thing. Yeah. And just yeah, that's a great little rabbit hole of Google. Oh yeah. The auto EQ thing. There's some great videos. I'll show that on my video. Yeah. There's some great information on that that I took in, basically understood it, applied it, and it like it was a different pair of headphones. It was entirely different. And then when you go back, you feel so sad. Like when I take that thing off, I was like, how does anybody listen to music like this? What are we, animals? Exactly. You know, like it's... So it was a weird bit of tech and it changed my headphone mixing life radically. Exactly. Instantly.
Chris: Yeah, same here. It's not everyone that likes it. Like that likes it for sure.
Steve: But just the idea that you could do that. You could. And from there, you start tweaking to taste. Yes. Right. And that was it. I was like, oh, if I had more time, if I only said phones, I didn't have to bring them back to Chris. Tomorrow. Then I would have spent time and just tweaked and tweaked and tweaked. So there is...
Chris: Because there's often a boost, especially on the lows, the low end, when it comes to the Harman curve. On most headphones. Not all of them, but on most headphones.
Steve: Some of them just squiggle up on the high end. Yes. You can see it. Just kind of a little squiggle.
Chris: And those two extremes are always the ones I just tame down a bit to my taste. Yeah. You know, just to read the sweet spot.
Steve: So... So... Does a well-ecued, beautifully constructed and paid for? Probably monthly. Some of these headphones cases. The bank is going to own them for the first year and a half. For sure. Does that replace a good set of speakers?
Chris: To an extent, I think it has a potential to. Do I think it's... It's... I still use my speakers. At first, when I first start to mix, use my speakers all the time. And check on that phone.
Steve: And if you don't have great speaker, because the best pair of headphones, you're a really good pair, you're 5 grand or something. A really good pair of speakers, you're 10 times that, right? Or 20 grand for some big boxes. It could go pretty... So, yeah. So is it apples and apples there? Do you know what I mean? Do you know what I mean? Like if I have a $5,000 pair of speakers and a $5,000 pair of headphones, are we still switching? Are we giving them a good way?
Chris: The big difference was it's going to be the room. Which is another... You know, because like the good thing about the headphones is that it gets rid of the room aspect of using speakers. Now, speakers, you can have like a 10,000, $10,000 set of speakers in a crappy room. It's going to sound crappy. Yeah. Okay. The speakers will sound good, but the room, the reflections, all that stuff is going to hold you down. Exponential problems. Yeah. So you're better off with a cheaper pair of speakers and a very better well-treated room than the other way around, in my opinion. Yeah. I agree. And this is the part that headphones will get rid of, the room part, which is an advantage on mixing one headphones. Right out of the box. However, there's some stuff that we get when listening to you a speaker environment and there's, you know, in a controlled room that we don't get on headphones, like the crosstalk effect. Which is? Which is basically, you know, when you listen to speakers, you have your left ear that is still going to grasp some sound coming out of the left speaker. Mm-hmm. Okay. Did I say that right?
Steve: Right. Left. Okay. But we know. You know. Because you're right. Very effectively. Yeah. So that helps.
Chris: So you need to watch the video over through the podcast, or else you're going to be lost. The speaker opposite your ear. There you go. The speaker opposite to your ear.
Steve: Basically, both your ears are always hearing both speakers.
Chris: Yes. Not at the same level, but they still... Yes. Versus headphones,
Steve: where they're running your ear hole. Right up there in your... Yeah.
Chris: So that cross feed, cross bleed effect is... Yeah, there's none on that. And there are some little plug-in things.
Steve: But there's plug-ins. Yeah.
Chris: There's a plug-in for everything. There's a plug-in called... Was it Canopener, I think? Yeah. Canopener is one of them. And the only job it does is the cross-stock. That's it. It's pretty cool. It is cool. So even if you just, you know, get your left headphone out of the way, and you just pan the left single only, and you're going to hear it on the right side. And quieter, but you still, you know, it gives you that effect, a more natural effect on that.
Steve: And if you think about it, it's really a cool name. It is. It took me a minute. I was like, what? Oh, I get it. I get it. I get it.
Chris: And there's other software. Every room emulation plug-in for headphones will have by default a cross-stock also.
Steve: Here's a... Yeah, because that's a lot of what room emulation
Chris: plugs are doing. They are. Right? They will bring you in a room, basically, in a tree room. They could bring you in a car. It could bring you depending on which plug-in you use, you know. Like brands of cars. It's pretty good.
Steve: It's wild. The Jaguar. Tasteload. Yeah, I love that. It's funny. What a time to be alive.
Chris: I know. I still never use them, but still a good time to be alive.
Steve: It's good to know they're there. Here's my question I thought of on the way here today that I wanted to ask you. I call you and I go,
Chris, your favorite band just released their new album. And you're like, ah, I didn't know that. And I go, it sounds amazing. Drum sound amazing. Great low end, great sizzle, great sound, great vocals. It sounds awesome. It's the new remix of Baby Shark or whatever. Whatever you're going to do that month. Do you do, how do you listen? How do you, you're going to, you're going to just going to sit down and take this thing in. You got your little wine and French Canadian wine, and you're going to enjoy this thing. What, how do you do it?
Chris: I'm going to pour myself a little glass of bumble. Yeah.
Steve: Okay. My favorite drop. Oh, it's delicious. Okay. The best. Delicious. I've heard. You've heard about it. I can't afford it.
Chris: I'm going to use my, one of my favorite pair of headphones. So headphones. Yeah. That was, that was, that was.
Steve: That was the, that was the, that was the, that was the, that was the, that I had to.
Chris: And funny enough, I do even within my, on my Mac, on my system. Yeah. I have this little app, which is called, let me check here. Sound source. I actually talked about that on my video also. And I have my, uh, EQ profile. Applied to my headphones. Yeah. And with Canopener also. Yeah. Applied straight out of the headphones.
Steve: Headphones. Headphones. You got a beautiful room, beautiful speakers and headphones is where you go. That was the thought I had on the way here. I'm going to switch to, to speakers after, you know, but my first me too.
Chris: I'm just going to put on my headphones. I'll probably put in my AirPods. And you know what? Lots of people do the majority of music listeners in 2024 and during 2025 are going to listen, consume music on headphones.
Steve: Yes. It's interesting. It is. And that was the thought I had. Like in a beautiful room with beautiful speakers. I still would put on headphones.
Chris: And especially now that I finished my panels, you know, my acoustic panels. I don't have like those left over.
Steve: I do left over there. Left over there. It's been a journey for you. It was quite a pleasure.
Chris: Congratulations. Thank you. It looks nice. I just need to fix them on the wall now. But that's it. Next year. One step at a time.
Steve: So, so headphones for the listening win. I, for now, that's a, that's a, that's a please comment these days. Please comment on that. If you have a nicely treated room, do you headphones first or speakers first when your new baby shark?
Chris: Yeah. But the thing is, on my end though, you know, I moved into this space a year and a half ago. I only had like leftovers of acoustic material from my older studio, which I recycled into these little panels. You can actually see on the video version of the podcast. So it's. I don't know if I trusted my room as much as I trust my mice.
Steve: But just for pleasure listening. Headphones? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Interesting. I do. So that kind of, that kind of sums up the whole episode there. I know. Headphones. Yeah.
Chris: Headphones are great. But when I mix and master, I always check on my speakers though. But I do it the other way around before I was checking on my headphones. Yeah. Mixing on speakers. Now I do the opposite. Like I would say 85% of my time. Yeah. I'm going to spend it on headphones. And even I use several pair of headphones, not even the same pair. Okay. So all these MM 500 for the most, most of my mixing. When I'm near the end of the mix, going towards mastering the head, the head that are going to be my, my way to go. It's going to be for mastering. You like those heads? Yeah, I do. But I always check in on speakers.
Steve: This could be my last question for you. But also that's an interview. Yeah. I'm interviewing the professor. Just because you spent a lot of time with these headphones. Oh, yeah. You learned a lot for that, for that video you did. That's what started this whole thing.
Chris: Actually, what started the whole thing is Paul 3rd with his video. Yeah. I was actually mixing on headphones at that, at that point, you know, but I was missing that little something, you know.
Steve: Yeah. That was such a fun conversation. You did what? Exactly. You could, what? Okay, I want to know more about that. We EQ everything in the studio. Why wouldn't we? We do it for room, the room acoustics. Yeah. Why wouldn't we EQ our headphones? It was such a stupidly simple. When you said it, I just like, I know my eggs fell almost by my fork.
Chris: Remember back in the day, you know, you had like that nice sound system, you put on a CD or cassette, you know, we're old enough to do, you know what cassettes were? A DAT tape. Exactly. And the first thing we did, oh, let's, you know, let's lose the bass and treble. Oh, yeah. Always. Yeah.
Steve: Turn that Dolby on and off. Of course. The hiss. Oh, yeah. Oh. That's the best. He did the hiss. It was awesome. That takes us. So my last thought is, does the, does the, the headphone amp conversion conversation, does it matter?
Chris: Okay. Now, I'm at this point now. Yeah. This will probably come for another episode. Yeah. If, if people are interested in knowing more about that, you know, because that is the next step. Yeah. Okay. What about the conversion? Yeah.
Steve: You plug the headphones into something. The amp. And you're still dependent on that. Like your sound is only as good as the thing you plug into on that levels.
Chris: For sure. For sure. Right now, I'm, you know, using my interface, which is the Steinberg XR4 interface. Yeah. Which I'm looking on replacing soon with something else. Yeah. For other reasons. Yeah. But now, again, I'm going to have to give another shout out to, to Paul Third about using an amp, you know, so. Yeah. I'm waiting. I'm waiting for, I'm supposed to receive the soon.
Steve: That's a smart guy. But he is, man. That's a, that's a guy. Smarted me, man. Smarted me. He doesn't want to be. A lot of stuff. Both of us combined. Dude. Oh, man.
Chris: He does. He does. Yeah.
Steve: Go ahead.
Chris: So I'm waiting. I'm waiting for my DAC. Okay. And my headphone amp. Okay. And I'll, I'll let you know if that is really, really worth it. Let me know.
Steve: I'm going to be here when you unbox it. I'll invite you. Pressed against the, I'll say the studio. Let's see.
Chris: Let's see. But apparently it's the way to go. Yes. A lot of audio files, like, you know, all audio files, you know, that uses headphones. They usually have like a bunch of different amps. It seems logical. It seems logical. It does. Yeah.
Steve: I mean, you're only as strong as your weakest link kind of thing, right? Yeah. So. Yeah.
Chris: But now the whole conversation will go after this point, after I'm done with the, the amp and DAC thing. Now what about atmos?
Steve: Oh, stop it.
Chris: There you go. That isn't going to be a, I guess. That's a four episode series.
Steve: A future conversation. Confusion.
Chris: Because the thing with atmos, okay. I'm not going to dive into atmos.
Steve: Yeah.
Chris: For episodes. For. But. I'm waiting for the perfect salute, like the right solution to start mixing atmos using headphones.
Steve: It'll come. It's probably already here. We'll see. Because that's how a lot of people are taking it in anyway. Yes. A majority, I would guess. So.
Chris: So my question, okay. Why would I invest thousands of dollars into a full atmos speaker setup? If I can, I don't know, four episodes here. Maybe it's the same question as using speakers for mixing, you know. Yeah. Of those two, two headphones. Okay. Which I still think speakers are a good way to go. Even if you have like, if the room is not perfectly treated. Yeah. It's good to have a good pair of speakers.
Steve: They are all tools. Yeah. All of them. Tools. None of them are the solution. That's what I've learned. I've learned that too. Just buy them all.
Chris: All right, Steve. So this is time for our Q&A portion of the podcast. And this question is by Stefan. So watching a YouTube video, the guy said that before he starts a mix, he always converts his virtual instrument, stereo files into mono audio files for instruments like drums, bass, stuff like that. You know, so what are your thoughts? He's asking, okay, what, why would you do this? What are the benefits and does it even matter?
Steve: So he is saying, if I interpret correctly, stereo file. Where both sides are identical. Exactly. The thing gets, yeah, like a bass.
Chris: A bass or kick drum.
Steve: So you get a stereo, yeah, I get that all the time. People, can you mix my stuff? And I get like 32 stereo tracks. Probably recorded in logic. And yeah. And very few of them are actually stereo tracks. So yeah, I think first thing in my head is always to make sure they are truly mono. So I'll just click, you know, face flip and make sure it's actually mono. Because sometimes I've made that mistake too. Yeah. Where in the third course, I was supposed to do this and I checked it, killed it and whatever. So yeah, first check, then blow them into two mono's and then delete one side, right? And I think in my mind, the main reason is for me personally, is my touch of OCD. Just thanks me. That mono is mono and stereo stereo. And so when I'm dealing with it later, I just know, I know this is mono in my head. When I look at it, I know it's mono. Obviously plug in processing. There's a little, little advantage there. Panning is huge. And you're not doing this weird, like some panning and you're not dealing with all this panning. Yes. Madness. You just have one little waggly woo to swing left or right and away you go. That's a huge one for me. That's the biggest one is all that complex panning in these, you know, in the DAWS now. Just confuse my brain, right? And so that, I guess those would be the main reasons in my head. Do you have any additional?
Chris: No, I think you covered probably like everything that I think on my side too, you know. For me, you know, looking at a session, I know that the drums, especially drums, you know, a bass. I want to know which of the channels are stereo and which are mono. So drums, it's pretty obvious. So I know right away if I like, I have a bunch of stereo drum tracks, it's going to drive me crazy. Yeah.
Steve: You know, even in busing, like you're not busing to two places. Exactly. Everything just, it just becomes way clearer.
Chris: Exactly. Is it going to stop me from mixing a song? No. No, I hope not. You know, no.
Steve: You need a different hobby. Well, I can't mix music anymore. All the tracks are in the stereo. I quit. My mom said I should get a job today's the day.
Chris: So, you know, it doesn't matter. Like, it's a workflow thing for me and for, you know, from one understand from you. Yeah. Also, does it really matter on the sound of the project? Nope. No. No. No. I don't think it's going to change much. Yeah. There's probably going to be a volume difference between a mono version and a tiny, a tiny touch. You know, the stereo version might be a bit quieter. It removes the redundant. But that's it. Yeah. That's it. But so what are the benefits he's asking? Yeah. For me, it's all about workflow. Like you said.
Steve: Yeah. Yep.
Chris: Yeah.
Steve: It's just one less distraction. And some of these mixes are so dense, right? It's just one less thing to think about. Exactly. At midnight. Exactly.
Chris: And yeah, and all that to say that, and that wasn't part of the question, but it leads also to bouncing your MIDI virtual instruments into audio. Is this something you do on all sessions or do you mix on your side virtual, like the MIDI version of an intro? It depends on instruments.
Steve: Typically, a bounce. Yeah. Bounce. Bounce are freeze or committ or whatever makes sense in that instance. But yeah, I just I don't trust them to come back two days later. And it's still the same thing. Exactly. It's a trust. And it's because I lived through it's way better now, but I lived through the era where it was a kick yesterday. It's a flute today. Right. Just like, like that. That you hear that a couple times in your life. You start committing committing that day. How am I not to do anything wrong with flute. If you're a flute player, no offense. You're a kick flute. But yeah, it's it. It's the count of the niggas of the kick and flute that's just off for some reason. I actually did an impression of a kick. I love it. I love it. So yeah, that's it. It's for me. It's just a it's a trust factor. Any other questions?
Chris: I don't think I think we're the first episode. It's not going to be good enough.
Steve: It was a time for rum.
Chris: So that was fun. That was the first podcast. It might be the last. Maybe the last. We'll see. We'll see. Hopefully my mom will listen.
Steve: I, our wives might not let us do this anymore.
Chris: So I hope you enjoyed this episode of the Studio Stuff podcast. And we'll see you next time. Yes.
Steve: Hopefully.
